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Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/8/2008 12:15:30 PM
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edrummer
Posts: 11
Joined: 9/19/2006
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Interesting data below. It shows that the bottom 50% of income earners pay about 3% of the federal income taxes and the tax burden on them has been decreasing. The top 10% of income earners pay 71% of the federal income taxes and their tax burden has been increasing. The top 5 percent (AGI > $153K) pay 60% of the federal income taxes. I believe the AGI is household income.
Further analysis shows that the top 5% earn 37% of the AGI and pay 60% of the taxes. The bottom 50% earn 12.5% of the AGI and pay 3% (and that's fine).
Now, I'm all for the bottom 50% paying low taxes. I'm for everyone paying low taxes. But, the rhetoric that "the rich don't pay their fair share" is an outright lie and I'm tired of it being propagated. In the area I live, a household AGI of $153K is not rich. It's comfortable, but not rich. $108K in my area will get you by if you're debt free.
I just think the discussion on taxes should be based on data and this is what the IRS found. We should be thankful we live in a country where people can pursue their dreams and get rich...and pay our taxes. 
For Tax Year 2006
Column 1 Percentiles Ranked by AGI
Column 2 AGI Threshold on Percentiles
Column 3 Percentage of Federal Personal Income Tax Paid
Top 1% $388,806 39.89%
Top 5% $153,542 60.14%
Top 10% $108,904 70.79%
Top 25% $64,702 86.27%
Top 50% $31,987 97.01%
Bottom 50% <$31,987 2.99%
Note: AGI is Adjusted Gross Income
Source: Internal Revenue Service
For Tax Year 2005
Top 1% $364,657 39.38 %
Top 5% $145,283 59.67 %
Top 10% $103,912 70.30 %
Top 25% $62,068 85.99 %
Top 50% $30,881 96.93 %
Bottom 50% <$30,881 3.07%
Note: AGI is Adjusted Gross Income
Source: Internal Revenue Service
For Tax Year 2004
Top 1% $328,049 36.89 %
Top 5% $137,056 57.13 %
Top 10% $99,112 68.19 %
Top 25% $60,041 84.86 %
Top 50% $30,122 96.70 %
Bottom 50% <$30,122 3.30 %
Note: AGI is Adjusted Gross Income
Source: Internal Revenue Service
For Tax Year 2003
Top 1% $295,495 34.27
Top 5% $130,080 54.36
Top 10% $94,891 65.84
Top 25% $57,343 83.88
Top 50% $29,019 96.54
Bottom 50% <$29,019 3.46
Note: AGI is Adjusted Gross Income
Source: Internal Revenue Service
and so on....
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/8/2008 12:34:19 PM
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Dubya
Posts: 1017
Joined: 10/25/2006
From: Texas
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: edrummer
Interesting data below. It shows that the bottom 50% of income earners pay about 3% of the federal income taxes and the tax burden on them has been decreasing. The top 10% of income earners pay 71% of the federal income taxes and their tax burden has been increasing. The top 5 percent (AGI > $153K) pay 60% of the federal income taxes. I believe the AGI is household income.
Further analysis shows that the top 5% earn 37% of the AGI and pay 60% of the taxes. The bottom 50% earn 12.5% of the AGI and pay 3% (and that's fine).
Now, I'm all for the bottom 50% paying low taxes. I'm for everyone paying low taxes. But, the rhetoric that "the rich don't pay their fair share" is an outright lie and I'm tired of it being propagated. In the area I live, a household AGI of $153K is not rich. It's comfortable, but not rich. $108K in my area will get you by if you're debt free.
I just think the discussion on taxes should be based on data and this is what the IRS found. We should be thankful we live in a country where people can pursue their dreams and get rich...and pay our taxes.
For Tax Year 2006
Column 1 Percentiles Ranked by AGI
Column 2 AGI Threshold on Percentiles
Column 3 Percentage of Federal Personal Income Tax Paid
Top 1% $388,806 39.89%
Top 5% $153,542 60.14%
Top 10% $108,904 70.79%
Top 25% $64,702 86.27%
Top 50% $31,987 97.01%
Bottom 50% <$31,987 2.99%
Note: AGI is Adjusted Gross Income
Source: Internal Revenue Service
For Tax Year 2005
Top 1% $364,657 39.38 %
Top 5% $145,283 59.67 %
Top 10% $103,912 70.30 %
Top 25% $62,068 85.99 %
Top 50% $30,881 96.93 %
Bottom 50% <$30,881 3.07%
Note: AGI is Adjusted Gross Income
Source: Internal Revenue Service
For Tax Year 2004
Top 1% $328,049 36.89 %
Top 5% $137,056 57.13 %
Top 10% $99,112 68.19 %
Top 25% $60,041 84.86 %
Top 50% $30,122 96.70 %
Bottom 50% <$30,122 3.30 %
Note: AGI is Adjusted Gross Income
Source: Internal Revenue Service
For Tax Year 2003
Top 1% $295,495 34.27
Top 5% $130,080 54.36
Top 10% $94,891 65.84
Top 25% $57,343 83.88
Top 50% $29,019 96.54
Bottom 50% <$29,019 3.46
Note: AGI is Adjusted Gross Income
Source: Internal Revenue Service
and so on....
So basically, the bottom 50% has consistently benefitted fromthe Bush tax policy.
Amazing!!!!
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/8/2008 12:36:43 PM
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mapachito13
Posts: 2537
Joined: 10/1/2007
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Is the percentage paid that you show that of the total tax bill or of the individual's/households AGI?
_____________________________
Peace Sells....But Who's Buying!
"I would argue that the most serious threat to the United States is not someone hiding in a cave in Pakistan or Afghanistan, but our own fiscal irresponsibility."-David Walker, fmr comptroller general of the US
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/8/2008 12:46:57 PM
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edrummer
Posts: 11
Joined: 9/19/2006
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: mapachito13
Is the percentage paid that you show that of the total tax bill or of the individual's/households AGI?
The former.
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/8/2008 12:52:22 PM
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uncabeeil
Posts: 5792
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Joisey. Got a problem wit dat?
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: edrummer
quote:
ORIGINAL: mapachito13
Is the percentage paid that you show that of the total tax bill or of the individual's/households AGI?
The former.
Try the same exercise based on the latter and I think you'll find a vastly different story.
_____________________________
In loving memory of all who gave that we might be free
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/8/2008 1:20:25 PM
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mapachito13
Posts: 2537
Joined: 10/1/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: uncabeeil
quote:
ORIGINAL: edrummer
quote:
ORIGINAL: mapachito13
Is the percentage paid that you show that of the total tax bill or of the individual's/households AGI?
The former.
Try the same exercise based on the latter and I think you'll find a vastly different story.
I notice that this figure is after deductions and only for those with a positive AGI (IOW they didn't have enough deductions or a creative enough accountant to wipe out their taxable earnings). Is there a table that shows how much tax is paid based on a percentage of the gross income? Before the deductions, tax exemptions and credits come into play?
I didn't realize I was one of the top 25%! Why doesn't it feel like I am?
_____________________________
Peace Sells....But Who's Buying!
"I would argue that the most serious threat to the United States is not someone hiding in a cave in Pakistan or Afghanistan, but our own fiscal irresponsibility."-David Walker, fmr comptroller general of the US
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/8/2008 1:25:31 PM
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edrummer
Posts: 11
Joined: 9/19/2006
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: uncabeeil
quote:
ORIGINAL: edrummer
quote:
ORIGINAL: mapachito13
Is the percentage paid that you show that of the total tax bill or of the individual's/households AGI?
The former.
Try the same exercise based on the latter and I think you'll find a vastly different story.
Will you do that for us?
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/8/2008 1:26:57 PM
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edrummer
Posts: 11
Joined: 9/19/2006
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: mapachito13
quote:
ORIGINAL: uncabeeil
quote:
ORIGINAL: edrummer
quote:
ORIGINAL: mapachito13
Is the percentage paid that you show that of the total tax bill or of the individual's/households AGI?
The former.
Try the same exercise based on the latter and I think you'll find a vastly different story.
I notice that this figure is after deductions and only for those with a positive AGI (IOW they didn't have enough deductions or a creative enough accountant to wipe out their taxable earnings). Is there a table that shows how much tax is paid based on a percentage of the gross income? Before the deductions, tax exemptions and credits come into play?
I didn't realize I was one of the top 25%! Why doesn't it feel like I am?
The figure is adjusted GROSS income before deductions.
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/8/2008 3:43:07 PM
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uncabeeil
Posts: 5792
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Joisey. Got a problem wit dat?
Status: online
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quote:
ORIGINAL: edrummer
quote:
ORIGINAL: uncabeeil
quote:
ORIGINAL: edrummer
quote:
ORIGINAL: mapachito13
Is the percentage paid that you show that of the total tax bill or of the individual's/households AGI?
The former.
Try the same exercise based on the latter and I think you'll find a vastly different story.
Will you do that for us?
Wouldn't know where to start. Figured since you came up with all of that, you could do it again with a slightly different set of parameters.
On a hunch, I think you'd find those with the most are the ones paying the least since they can afford to hire accountants and lawyers to find all the loopholes that "Joe Sixpack" doesn't know about.
_____________________________
In loving memory of all who gave that we might be free
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/8/2008 3:44:43 PM
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ekserekseez
Posts: 692
Joined: 7/3/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
In the area I live, a household AGI of $153K is not rich.
You've got that right. I've spent that much on clothes in one year.
The point should not be who has what percentage of the tax burden. EVERYONE'S taxes are too high, because the government funds stupid, illegal, and unconstitutional enterprises.
If the federal government restricted itself to its constitutional limits, EVERYONE'S taxes would go down. Including mine, which is my main point.
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/8/2008 4:59:52 PM
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rlj
Posts: 2199
Joined: 4/14/2005
Status: online
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quote:
So basically, the bottom 50% has consistently benefitted fromthe Bush tax policy.
Amazing!!!!
It's really sad how much I dislike the president when I pay about $25 a year in federal taxes and this year the government has given me 5.5kish or so.
_____________________________
-Roger
This is who I'm voting for. He is from the same party I voted for last time. This is consistent with my belief in the failure of the two party system and my disgust with it.
http://www.baldwin08.com/#
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/8/2008 7:07:00 PM
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GroupW
Posts: 2906
Joined: 11/16/2007
From: Up in the hills of Colorado (very BIG hills...)
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: uncabeeil
quote:
ORIGINAL: edrummer
quote:
ORIGINAL: uncabeeil
quote:
ORIGINAL: edrummer
quote:
ORIGINAL: mapachito13
Is the percentage paid that you show that of the total tax bill or of the individual's/households AGI?
The former.
Try the same exercise based on the latter and I think you'll find a vastly different story.
Will you do that for us?
Wouldn't know where to start. Figured since you came up with all of that, you could do it again with a slightly different set of parameters.
On a hunch, I think you'd find those with the most are the ones paying the least since they can afford to hire accountants and lawyers to find all the loopholes that "Joe Sixpack" doesn't know about.
That used to be the case. AMT has pretty much fixed that. Of course, in the process it's snagging a whole bunch of middle class folk along with the rich ones now. I can work up those numbers for you pretty easily. Bad news - Generally speaking, they don't support your hunch.
_____________________________
“For every problem, there is a solution that is simple, elegant and wrong.” -H.L. Mencken
"Most people would rather die than think; in fact, they do so." -Bertrand Russell
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/8/2008 8:26:42 PM
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iluvatar
Posts: 1964
Joined: 4/12/2005
Status: online
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What's left out of these figures is the percentage of total income is earned within these brackets. Even with a flat tax, when omitting that figure, the "Top 1%" will still appear to pay a disproportionate amount of the overall tax.
-Dan.
_____________________________
Well, I've been to one world fair, a picnic, and a rodeo, and that's the stupidest thing I ever heard come over a set of earphones.
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/8/2008 10:43:45 PM
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mapachito13
Posts: 2537
Joined: 10/1/2007
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: GroupW
That used to be the case. AMT has pretty much fixed that. Of course, in the process it's snagging a whole bunch of middle class folk along with the rich ones now. I can work up those numbers for you pretty easily. Bad news - Generally speaking, they don't support your hunch.
There are of course the upper 1% who sometimes have special, tailor made, tax deductions courtesy of the federal legislator that they paid off (ahem) gave them a sizeable campaign contribution! There is also the coporation shell game that these guys play to shield their money from the tax man as well.
But please post your numbers, with the verifiable links as well, it would be much appreciated!
_____________________________
Peace Sells....But Who's Buying!
"I would argue that the most serious threat to the United States is not someone hiding in a cave in Pakistan or Afghanistan, but our own fiscal irresponsibility."-David Walker, fmr comptroller general of the US
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/9/2008 10:36:18 AM
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kernsfamily
Posts: 1349
Joined: 4/26/2006
From: Dallas (originally Detroit)
Status: online
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quote:
There are of course the upper 1% who sometimes have special, tailor made, tax deductions courtesy of the federal legislator that they paid off (ahem) gave them a sizeable campaign contribution! There is also the coporation shell game that these guys play to shield their money from the tax man as well.
If that WERE the case (please cite specific examples of these "super secret deductions" if it IS the case)....then, wouldn't the SHARE of taxes paid by all those "TOP 1%" people be lower? And, instead of their share of taxes they paid going UP over the past several years, wouldn't the "share" of what they pay actually be going DOWN?
does AMT not "apply" to them?
if not, explain how.
_____________________________
Proud dad of 3 great girls....Erin, Emilie and Elise
Blessed to have all of them in a "totally awesome" public elementary school!
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/9/2008 10:47:45 AM
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upNORTder
Posts: 218
Joined: 7/20/2006
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: Dubya
quote:
ORIGINAL: edrummer
Interesting data below. It shows that the bottom 50% of income earners pay about 3% of the federal income taxes and the tax burden on them has been decreasing. The top 10% of income earners pay 71% of the federal income taxes and their tax burden has been increasing. The top 5 percent (AGI > $153K) pay 60% of the federal income taxes. I believe the AGI is household income.
Further analysis shows that the top 5% earn 37% of the AGI and pay 60% of the taxes. The bottom 50% earn 12.5% of the AGI and pay 3% (and that's fine).
Now, I'm all for the bottom 50% paying low taxes. I'm for everyone paying low taxes. But, the rhetoric that "the rich don't pay their fair share" is an outright lie and I'm tired of it being propagated. In the area I live, a household AGI of $153K is not rich. It's comfortable, but not rich. $108K in my area will get you by if you're debt free.
I just think the discussion on taxes should be based on data and this is what the IRS found. We should be thankful we live in a country where people can pursue their dreams and get rich...and pay our taxes.
For Tax Year 2006
Column 1 Percentiles Ranked by AGI
Column 2 AGI Threshold on Percentiles
Column 3 Percentage of Federal Personal Income Tax Paid
Top 1% $388,806 39.89%
Top 5% $153,542 60.14%
Top 10% $108,904 70.79%
Top 25% $64,702 86.27%
Top 50% $31,987 97.01%
Bottom 50% <$31,987 2.99%
Note: AGI is Adjusted Gross Income
Source: Internal Revenue Service
For Tax Year 2005
Top 1% $364,657 39.38 %
Top 5% $145,283 59.67 %
Top 10% $103,912 70.30 %
Top 25% $62,068 85.99 %
Top 50% $30,881 96.93 %
Bottom 50% <$30,881 3.07%
Note: AGI is Adjusted Gross Income
Source: Internal Revenue Service
For Tax Year 2004
Top 1% $328,049 36.89 %
Top 5% $137,056 57.13 %
Top 10% $99,112 68.19 %
Top 25% $60,041 84.86 %
Top 50% $30,122 96.70 %
Bottom 50% <$30,122 3.30 %
Note: AGI is Adjusted Gross Income
Source: Internal Revenue Service
For Tax Year 2003
Top 1% $295,495 34.27
Top 5% $130,080 54.36
Top 10% $94,891 65.84
Top 25% $57,343 83.88
Top 50% $29,019 96.54
Bottom 50% <$29,019 3.46
Note: AGI is Adjusted Gross Income
Source: Internal Revenue Service
and so on....
So basically, the bottom 50% has consistently benefitted fromthe Bush tax policy.
Amazing!!!!
I'd rather make more AND pay more taxes than "benifitting" by having my wages kept low by Bushes policies. I suppose all the unemployed should thank George that they don't have to pay any income tax. Way to go GWB.
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/9/2008 10:58:51 AM
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kernsfamily
Posts: 1349
Joined: 4/26/2006
From: Dallas (originally Detroit)
Status: online
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quote:
I'd rather make more AND pay more taxes than "benifitting" by having my wages kept low by Bushes policies. I suppose all the unemployed should thank George that they don't have to pay any income tax. Way to go GWB.
Wages kept low by Bush's policies???
A President has NOTHING to do with your wages....(except, of course, be the one to blame if it isn't what you want it to be)...
I was unemployed, and UNDER-employed in the late 1990s....exactly WHICH "policies" of Clinton's do I blame for that?
Over the past 5 years....my salary has skyrocketed (and MANY people I know have been doing quite well...it's not just me) .....exactly WHICH "policies" of Bush's do I credit for that? (way to go GWB!)
YOUR PERSONAL financial condition is controlled much more by what happens in YOUR house, than by who is in the WHITE HOUSE, or anything that happens there.
_____________________________
Proud dad of 3 great girls....Erin, Emilie and Elise
Blessed to have all of them in a "totally awesome" public elementary school!
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/9/2008 12:33:11 PM
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stamper_ben
Posts: 10946
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: Lone Star State
Status: offline
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quote:
Wages kept low by Bush's policies??? Yes. Didn't you know that in that secret underground bunker where Cheney hides out all the time is where GW and the cabal sit down and plan every man, woman and child's wage? 
_____________________________
We will be known as His by the love we show one another.
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/9/2008 1:28:15 PM
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letusreason
Posts: 833
Joined: 8/30/2008
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: upNORTder
I'd rather make more AND pay more taxes than "benifitting" by having my wages kept low by Bushes policies. I suppose all the unemployed should thank George that they don't have to pay any income tax. Way to go GWB.
Looks like your comedic avatar suits your comedic statements pretty well.
You will get your second wish if Obama is elected.
As for Bush, you are mislead. His tax cuts increased income.
Read the facts.
"information is from page 46 of the Census Bureau report, "Income, Poverty and Health Insurance in the United States: 2006,"
http://www.bizzyblog.com/wp-images/CensusIncomeQuintilesEtc2003to2006.jpg
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/9/2008 4:02:30 PM
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GroupW
Posts: 2906
Joined: 11/16/2007
From: Up in the hills of Colorado (very BIG hills...)
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: mapachito13
quote:
ORIGINAL: GroupW
That used to be the case. AMT has pretty much fixed that. Of course, in the process it's snagging a whole bunch of middle class folk along with the rich ones now. I can work up those numbers for you pretty easily. Bad news - Generally speaking, they don't support your hunch.
There are of course the upper 1% who sometimes have special, tailor made, tax deductions courtesy of the federal legislator that they paid off (ahem) gave them a sizeable campaign contribution! There is also the coporation shell game that these guys play to shield their money from the tax man as well.
But please post your numbers, with the verifiable links as well, it would be much appreciated!
Thanks for the reminder. I'll do that as soon as I can break free.
_____________________________
“For every problem, there is a solution that is simple, elegant and wrong.” -H.L. Mencken
"Most people would rather die than think; in fact, they do so." -Bertrand Russell
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/9/2008 5:51:36 PM
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GroupW
Posts: 2906
Joined: 11/16/2007
From: Up in the hills of Colorado (very BIG hills...)
Status: offline
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Here's what I've got for 2005:
Top 1% - 23.1% effective tax rate
Top 2-5% - 17.4% effective tax rate
Top 6-10% - 12.4% effective tax rate
Top 11-25% - 9.3% effective tax rate
Top 26-50% - 6.9% effective tax rate
Bottom 50% - 3.0% effective tax rate
Sources: Tax Foundation, IRS
That's for all returns with positive AGI's. AGI is wages, salaries and tips, capital gains, rents, alimonies, dividends, interest, royalties, farm income, unemployment comp, and a few other types of income. Fairly comprehensive with very few exclusions.
Deductions from AGI are allowed for Health Savings Accounts, business expenses for performing artists/reservists, moving expenses, 50% of any self-employment tax, early withdrawal penalties on savings, alimony, IRA deductions, and student loan deductions.
Generally speaking, these are all substantially limited deductions. It would be hard at high levels of income to come up with a negative AGI. Trust me - I've tried.
It's hard to escape the conclusion that the wealthiest aren't avoid very much taxation relative to the average effective tax rate.
_____________________________
“For every problem, there is a solution that is simple, elegant and wrong.” -H.L. Mencken
"Most people would rather die than think; in fact, they do so." -Bertrand Russell
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RE: Taxes: Who Pays What - 10/11/2008 9:46:34 AM
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earthless
Posts: 6273
Joined: 4/11/2005
From: where pigeons are wearing sweaters....
Status: online
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I have never been hired by a poor individual.
_____________________________
Probing Today's Religious Movements | Promoting Doctrinal Discernment & Critical Thinking | Providing Reasons for Christian Faith & Ethics
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